Today's session with one of the Old China Hands criticized by Joe McCarthy sets

out as clearly as can be the two sides in the China debate: JKF: "You know, I have to begin by correcting your remarks about me. This is a good Firing Line opportunity. I wasn't a supporter of Chairman Mao; I was a reporter of Chairman Mao, and I still am. They had a revolution in China, and it's the thinking that you represent which is one of our chief problems--not to accept the facts of life." WFB: "Well, you say you were not a supporter of Mao's revolution. I will now quote from you: 'The Maoist revolution is, on the whole, the best thing that has happened to the Chinese people in many centuries.' " JKF: "Yes. What was the date?" WFB: "'72. Now, have you changed your--" JKF: "Can you say the opposite?" WFB: "What's that?" JKF: "Can you say the opposite?" WFB: "Without any problem at all, in behalf at least of several million Chinese who were killed by Mao Tse-tung, and hundreds of thousands of intellectuals who were imprisoned by him." JKF: "The present view of Mao is very disillusioned, and it comes from the last decade of his reign, when so many people were damaged and China was set back.... The point I'm making is that you've got to begin with history."