We eventually get to defense per se--including arms control, the end game in

Vietnam, the ABM treaty--but most of the hour is spent on the character of Henry

Kissinger. Admiral Zumwalt had told Ronald Reagan--who had used the information in a speech--that Mr. Kissinger had frequently said, as WFB paraphrases it, that "the United States was fated to be the second-ranking power in the world and that it was the responsibility of the Secretary of State to see to it that in our negotiations the U.S. came out as strong as possible under the circumstances." Mr. Kissinger had heatedly denied this; Mr. Buckley wonders whether even if Admiral Zumwalt was quoting accurately it was proper to repeat a private conversation. EZ: "With regard to the scruples, the problem is a tough one... In my view the higher requirement is to get the debate out on the terms we need to debate it on; namely, this tragic view of the future which is leading us on a policy course ... which is very hard to understand in the light of the public explanation of it being given by Kissinger. Rather than to dissemble in the public view as he does, I think it's important to raise openly the question of his tragic view of the future and to have it debated."